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For The Wild


For The Wild Podcast is an anthology of the Anthropocene; focused on land-based protection, co-liberation and intersectional storytelling rooted in a paradigm shift away from human supremacy, endless growth and consumerism.


United States


For The Wild Podcast is an anthology of the Anthropocene; focused on land-based protection, co-liberation and intersectional storytelling rooted in a paradigm shift away from human supremacy, endless growth and consumerism.




SANDOR ELLIX KATZ on Cultures of Fermentation /359

“No organism is an island.” As Sandor Katz reminds us in this delightful and informative episode, all life on earth is deeply interdependent. Though modern food systems alienate us from our environments and from the ways, we cannot totally sever ourselves from the environments and nutrients that make life possible. Sandor shows that alienation and disconnection will not free us. Rather, settling into the overlapping and diverse entwinement of the more-than-human world may bring connection and sustenance in close relation to our food production. The story of humanity is embedded in our food, embedded in the daily tasks and practical measures that sustain us. This conversation bubbles over with wisdom, as Sandor shares stories and lessons from his decades of experience experimenting with the art of fermentation. Fermentation is the manifestation of biodiversity, and as Sandor emphasizes, the study of fermentation is as much a study of our own tastes and cultural transitions as it is a study of our environments. Sandor Ellix Katz is a fermentation revivalist. He is the author of five books: Wild Fermentation; The Art of Fermentation; The Revolution Will Not Be Microwaved; Fermentation as Metaphor; and his latest, Fermentation Journeys. Sandor's books, along with the hundreds of fermentation workshops he has taught around the world, have helped to catalyze a broad revival of the fermentation arts. A self-taught experimentalist who lives in rural Tennessee, the New York Times calls him “one of the unlikely rock stars of the American food scene.” Sandor is the recipient of a James Beard award and other honors. For more information, check out his website Music by Matthewdavid. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


BETTY MARTIN on The Language of Consent /358

In this week’s episode we tap deep into the trust, desire, intimacy, and vulnerability that come from relationality. Betty Martin offers her vast knowledge of bodywork, somatics, and consent to give listeners insight into what she calls “The Wheel of Consent,” a quadrant that details a practice of giving and receiving. Betty reminds us that access is a gift. No one is born with the knowledge of how to give and receive in the “perfect” way, rather we must learn and feel together – navigating boundaries and allowing ourselves to find what feels right. Intimacy is a deeply vulnerable act, and Betty discusses how we can create a sense of acceptance and safety as we root in our bodies rather than societal expectations. Throughout the conversation, Betty emphasizes that consent should be the baseline for interaction, not just in intimate relationships but in the world writ large. The questions we ask and the people we include in conversations about consent matter. Only in knowing our limits as individuals, as a society, and as a part of the more-than-human world can we find the true meaning of trusting ourselves, of tapping into generosity, and of comfort. Dr. Betty Martin has had her hands on people professionally for over 40 years, first as a Chiropractor and upon retiring from that practice, as a certified Surrogate Partner, Sacred Intimate, and Somatic Sex Educator. Her explorations in somatic-based therapy and practices informed her creation of the framework, The Wheel of Consent®. She wrote a book about it, called "The Art of Receiving and Giving: The Wheel of Consent", and travels the world teaching other practitioners how to use the practices and the model to keep their clients safe, and their sessions effective and satisfying. Music by Roehind and Vaughn Aed. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


KURT RUSSO on a Prayer of Mourning /357

How can a relationship with one animal open the door to the depths of humanity? In this episode, returning guest Kurt Russo shares how he came to see the world through Tokitae, a Southern Resident Orca held captive in the Miami Seaquarium for decades. As he mourns Tokitae’s recent death, Kurt reflects on the ways nature gives us signs of the greater mysteries of life. This conversation is equally rooted in the material realities of protecting the Salish Sea, the Snake River, and the more-than-human kin that call those places home, and the spiritual questions that cruelty and disregard for the more-than-human provoke. How has humanity gotten to such a point? Kurt shares guided wisdom about the realities of commodification, ecocide, and the capacity of the human soul for intentional cruelty. How we fight against such darkness matters not just for humanity, but for all with whom we share this precious earth. Kurt Russo is currently the Executive Director of the Indigenous-led nonprofit, Se’Si’Le, that is dedicated to the application of ancestral knowledge to reimagine our relationship to the nature of nature. He worked for the Lummi Nation from 1978-2020 in the area of sacred sites and treaty rights. He also served as Executive Director of the Native American Lands Conservancy in California from 1998-2016 and was Senior Advisor to the Kumeyaay-Digueno Land Conservancy of southern California. He was the co-founder and Executive Director of the Florence R. Kluckhohn Center for the Study of Values from 1987-2002. He has a BS and MS in Forestry and a PhD in History. He has worked abroad with Indigenous communities in their efforts to preserve their ancestral lands and knowledge in Mexico, Guatemala, Brazil, Ecuador, Peru, Bolivia, and Chile. For an extended version of this episode, join us at Music by Francesca Heart and Julius Smack. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


ERIN MANNING on the Choreography of Neurodiversity /356

Blending theory, practice, and fascinating cultural vision, this week’s conversation with Erin Manning calls into question the systems and practices that keep us stuck. Erin’s imagination and openness seem endless as she describes how we may work to create movements for other ways of being. Crucially, Erin describes her understanding of modalities of being, explaining that neurotypicality is a system that undergirds our ways of knowing and our ways of being a body. There is no singular “neurotypical person” just as there is no singular “neurodiverse” person. Rather, we are trained into a choreography that encourages us to “practice neurotypicality well” and punishes us if we do not. Understanding the ways these systems work is vital as we untangle the hegemony and oppression that have dictated what counts as knowledge, what is valuable in a body, and even what bodies are “worth” being alive. The episode shares the resounding call that “we owe everything to each other.” How can we give into that call? Erin Manning grounds in the interstices of philosophy, aesthetics and politics. Pedagogical experiments are central to her work, some of which occur at Concordia University in Montreal where she is a research chair in Speculative Pragmatism, Art and Pedagogy in the Faculty of Fine Arts. She is concerned, always, about alter-pedagogical and alter-economic practices. She has written The Minor Gesture, For a Pragmatics of the Useless, Out of the Clear, and The Being of Relation (forthcoming). Her artwork is textile-based, relationally-oriented, and often participatory. Her current research is focused on 3e —an exploration of the transversality of the three ecologies, the social, the environmental and the conceptual. Music by Johanna Knutsson courtesy of Patience Records. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


CORRINA GOULD on Settler Responsibility and Reciprocity [ENCORE] /355

This week we are taking a pause from our regularly scheduled releases to rebroadcast Corrina Gould’s potent and powerful episode that originally aired in November 2020. We hope that this episode serves as a reminder of humanity and land rematriation in the face of deep colonial violence. The genocide in Palestine highlights the ways colonial forces of greed, extraction and brutal disregard for life and ties to the land are bearing their bloody teeth. We cannot return to “normal.” How can we catalyze action towards a future of reparation, responsibility, and reciprocity? In this episode of For The Wild, guest Corrina Gould reminds us that the land can sustain us in a way that would provide for our wellbeing should we choose to really re-examine what it is we need to survive. But more than a conversation on the wealth of the land, we explore responsibility and reciprocity on stolen homelands by asking what it means to be in right relationship? How can we foster integrity in conservation and land restoration work amidst a world that continues to peddle scarcity, greed, and extraction? How can folks contribute to the re-storying of the land, even if through small acts? Corrina Gould is the spokesperson for the Confederated Villages of Lisjan/Ohlone. She is an activist that has worked on preserving and protecting the ancient burial sites of her ancestors in the Bay Area for decades. She is the Co-founder and a Lead Organizer for Indian People Organizing for Change and co-founder of the Sogorea Te’ Land Trust. Music by Shayna Gladstone and Amo Amo. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


FARIHA RÓISÍN on the Courage of Listening to Our Bodies /354

This week, Fariha Róisín offers both timely and timeless wisdom on what it means to live in a body that has experienced trauma. This is a conversation that bears witness to the deep terror and distress of the world and still charges forward with undying compassion and care – the compassion and care of wild survival. Offering both deep personal reflection and spacious contemplation about the state of the world, Fariha reminds us that our bodies guide us to what we need. This episode brings up the things that we so often don’t want to touch – trauma, abuse, global systems of disregard – and handles them with care and love. Fariha shows us what it means to take pain seriously. Throughout the episode Fariha threads in a profound relationship with god, and a type of faith that is filled with questioning, fueled by queer thought, and driven by love. In even the darkest of times we can turn to love, accountability, and community to find the care that we need. Fariha Róisín is a multidisciplinary artist, born in Ontario, Canada. She was raised in Sydney, Australia, and is based in Los Angeles. As a Muslim queer Bangladeshi, she is interested in the margins, in liminality, otherness and the mercurial nature of being. Her work has pioneered a refreshing and renewed conversation about wellness, contemporary Islam and queer identities and has been featured in The New York Times, Al Jazeera, The Guardian, and Vogue. She is the author of the poetry collection How To Cure A Ghost (2019), as well as the novel Like A Bird (2020), Who Is Wellness For? (2022) and her second book of poetry is entitled Survival Takes a Wild Imagination, due fall 2023. For an extended version of this episode join us at Music by Misha Sultan (with special thanks to Patience Records), Amo Amo, Colloboh (with special thanks to Leaving Records), and Amber Rubarth. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


PERDITA FINN on the Long Story of Our Souls /353

Invoking ancestry, magic, and a deep relationship with the Dead, this week’s guest Perdita Finn invites listeners into a world of mystery. Perdita’s work, including her new book Take Back the Magic: Conversations with the Unseen World, calls humanity to engage with a faith in the unseen world, a faith in surrender, and a faith in the other side. For Perdita, this faith is not rooted in an otherworldly abstract idea of spirituality, but rather a grounded, embodied experience. As we come to face the existential questions of our time – war, climate change, and disasters of all kinds – Perdita reminds us that we are not alone. We can lean on our ancestors, both human and more-than-human, for strength. As we live into the long story of our souls, what wisdom can we pull from lives beyond this one? Tapping into creativity, resilience and connectedness, life comes after life, comes after life, and the meaning of our cyclical lineage is ever-present. Perdita Finn is the co-founder, with her husband Clark Strand, of the non-denominational international fellowship The Way of the Rose, which inspired their book The Way of the Rose: The Radical Path of the Divine Feminine Hidden in the Rosary. In addition to extensive study with Zen masters, priests, and healers, she apprenticed with the psychic Susan Saxman, with whom she wrote The Reluctant Psychic. Finn now teaches popular workshops on Getting to Know the Dead, in which participants are empowered to activate the magic in their own lives with the help of their ancestors. She is the author of Take Back the Magic: Conversations with the Unseen World and lives with her family in the moss-filled shadows of the Catskill Mountains. For an extended version of this episode please join us on Patreon at Music by The New Runes, Left Vessel, Eliza Edens, and Arthur Moon. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


JACQUELINE SUSKIN on The Poetry of Seasons /352

As those of us in the Northern Hemisphere enter into autumn, this week’s guest Jacqueline Suskin reminds us that the earth gives us dedicated time for reflection. In a conversation that roots deeply into seasonality and life’s rhythms, Jacqueline’s meditations and suggestions feel perfectly timed. Jacqueline uses her book A Year in Practice as a practical guide for finding inspiration and meaning throughout the seasons. Detailing her ongoing connection to the earth and the wonder she feels about humanity's place within and as a part of nature, Jacqueline details the way our rhythms are drawn from those of the earth. Even as the climate changes and we are beginning to lose the predictability of earth’s rhythms, our bodies carry the memory and significance of the seasons. Jacqueline reminds us that to find meaning in the sea of hope and hopelessness within modern movements, we must bear witness to the earth. Jacqueline Suskin is a poet and educator who has composed over forty thousand improvisational poems with her ongoing writing project, Poem Store. Suskin is the author of eight books, including the forthcoming A Year in Practice (Sounds True December 2023), with work featured in various publications including the New York Times, the Atlantic, and the Los Angeles Times. An ecstatic earth-worshiper, she lives in Detroit where she works as a teaching artist with InsideOut Literary Arts, bringing nature poetry into classrooms with her Poem Forest curriculum. Music by Green-House generously provided by Leaving Records. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


OBI KAUFMANN on the Ecotone of Art and Science /351

What is life at the edges of ecosystems, at the moments of convergence? In this week’s episode, guest Obi Kaufmann introduces listeners to his understanding of consilience – emphasizing the importance of art and science in sacred relationship. Obi shares in a reverie about what California has been and could be, and in doing so, he invites guests to imagine a world where we recognize nature as the undeniable truth of who we are. Obi brings rooted knowledge and esoteric inquiry to this conversation. His nuanced understandings of conservation, rewilding, and relating to the natural world, pull us into a framework for seeing a world of deep, beautiful relationality, even amidst pain and loss. Obi Kaufmann is an award-winning author of many best-selling books on California's ecology, biodiversity, and geography. Obi’s signature style is as artful as it is analytic, combining masterful renderings of wildlife, hand-painted maps, and data-driven storytelling to present a hopeful and integrated vision of California’s future. An avid conservationist, Obi Kaufmann regularly travels around the state, presenting his work and vision of ecological restoration and preservation from the Klamath-Siskiyou Wildland Center to the Mojave Desert Land Trust. Most recently, Obi was the artist-in-residence for the National Park Service at Whiskeytown National Recreation Area. You can catch him every month in conversation with author and tribal chairman Greg Sarris in their podcast called Place and Purpose. A lifelong resident of California, Obi Kaufmann makes his home base in Oakland and is currently working on Field Atlases to come. Music by Memotone, Magnetic Vines, and Daniela Lanaia. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


JASON BALDES on Buffalo and Land Rematriation /350

Bringing us to the Wind River Reservation, this week’s guest, Jason Baldes, shares his work to bring back wild Buffalo to Wind River and to rematriate land to the Eastern Shoshone and Northern Arapaho Tribes. Jason offers his deep wisdom about the ecological, spiritual, and cultural importance of Buffalo. Jason’s work with the Wind River Tribal Buffalo initiative has already had an immense effect. The physical and cultural landscape of the so-called United States is steeped in a colonial worldview, but work like Jason’s is changing the tides and aligning conservation with long-standing Indigenous values. This healing work honors those ancestors who had Buffalo, land, and ritual stolen from them by the United States government. Jason, an enrolled member of the Eastern Shoshone Tribe, received both his bachelor's and master's degrees in Land Resources & Environmental Sciences from Montana State University, where he focused on the restoration of Buffalo/bison to Tribal lands. In 2016 he spearheaded the successful effort to relocate a herd to the Wind River Indian Reservation and works with both the Eastern Shoshone and Northern Arapaho Tribes in buffalo management and expansion. He is an advocate, educator and speaker on Indigenous cultural revitalization and ecological restoration who has also served as director of the Wind River Native Advocacy Center, where he was instrumental in the passing of the Wyoming Indian Education for All Act. He currently splits time as executive director of the Wind River Tribal Buffalo Initiative, and Tribal Buffalo Program Senior Manager for the National Wildlife Federation's Tribal Partnerships Program. Jason sits on the board of directors of the Inter-Tribal Buffalo Council and the board of trustees for the Conservation Lands Foundation. For an extended version of this episode, please join us at Music by Jayme Stone and A.R. Wilson. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


The Edges in the Middle, VI: Báyò Akómoláfé, Madhulika Banerjee, and Minna Salami

Continuing the conversation series, “The Edges in the Middle,” presented in collaboration with UC Berkeley’s Othering and Belonging Institute, For The Wild is delighted to share this conversation between Báyò Akómoláfé, Madhulika Banerjee, and Minna Salami. Speaking on the theme, “Democracy and Its Exquisite Others,” Báyò, Madhulika, and Minna delve into an exploration of what it means to truly participate in democracy, as an embodied, collective action. In this thoughtful and informed episode, they investigate the idea of “Eurocracy'' and unpack what the eurocentric definition of democracy has meant for the world as a whole. Envisioning other ways of creating democracy, Báyò, Madhulika, and Minna describe festival democracy, democracies of contestations and dancing, and democracies of the more-than-human. “The Edges in the Middle” is a series of conversations between Báyò Akómoláfé and thought companions like john a. powell, V, Naomi Klein, and more. These limited episodes have been adapted from Báyò’s work as the Global Senior Fellow at UC Berkeley's Othering & Belonging Institute. In this role, Báyò has been holding a series of public conversations on issues of justice and belonging for the Institute's Democracy & Belonging Forum, which connects and resources civic leaders in Europe and the US who are committed to bridging across difference to strengthen democracy and advance belonging in both regions and around the world. Báyò's conversations encourage us to rethink justice, hope, and belonging by sitting amidst the noise, not trying to cover it up with pleasant rhythms. To learn more about the Democracy & Belonging Forum, visit Music by Sitka Sun generously provided by The Long Road Society Record Label and by Maree Siou. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


STEPHEN JENKINSON on a Lucid Reckoning /349

“We’re not trying to be right. We’re trying to see if we can see clearly.” In this agile and authentic episode, returning guest Stephen Jenkinson offers a lucid view of the world. How might our understanding of the world change if we approached life with a willingness to see things as they are rather than a need to only affirm that which we desire? Ayana and Stephen journey together to consider what had brought us to this modern time – prompting vital questions about the value of tradition, the importance of strangerhood, the possibility of reckoning, and the meaning of ancestry. Stephen asks questions that disrupt and unsettle the status quo, and perhaps these questions will lead us to the lessons we so deeply need. STEPHEN JENKINSON, MTS, MSW is an author, culture activist, ceremonialist and farmer. He teaches internationally and is the creator and principal instructor of the Orphan Wisdom School, founded in 2010. With Master’s degrees from Harvard University (Theology) and the University of Toronto (Social Work), he has worked extensively with dying people and their families, is a former programme director in a major Canadian hospital and former assistant professor in a prominent Canadian medical school. He is the author of several books including 'Reckoning', 'A Generation's Worth', 'Come of Age', 'Money & the Soul's Desires' and the award-winning 'Die Wise: A Manifesto for Sanity and Soul'. Stephen is the subject of the National Film Board of Canada documentary 'Griefwalker', and 'Lost Nation Road', a behind-the-scenes glimpse into the wheelhouse of a mystery train. Nights of Grief and Mystery world tours, with singer/ songwriter Gregory Hoskins, are odes to wonder, love letters for the willingness to know endings. Music by Nights of Grief and Mystery. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


ABDOUMALIQ SIMONE on Urban Entanglements /348

What does it mean to settle, to be in a settled place? This week’s guest, AbdouMaliq Simone has dedicated his work to investigating the specifics of urban organization as they are created by people. In this erudite and globally-positioned conversation, Ayana and AbdouMaliq meditate on how the design of our environments shapes us. AbdouMaliq talks us through the uncertain, vulnerable, and dynamic positions in the choreography of global cities, and contemplates what it means to live an urban life. From the entanglements of resistance and protest, to surveillance and governance, to the effects of climate change on the city environment, AbdouMaliq brings nuance and depth to this vital conversation. As humanity shapes the city, it shapes us in turn, and as the world rapidly urbanizes, AbdouMaliq calls listeners to think about what an urban politics could be. AbdouMaliq Simone is Senior Professorial Fellow at the Urban Institute, University of Sheffield and co-director of the Beyond Inhabitation Lab, Polytechnic University of Turin. Music by Jahawi. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


ANDREA GIBSON on The Blessings of the Wound /347

In an episode that cuts straight to the soul, this week’s guest Andrea Gibson joins Ayana in a conversation that asks what it means to truly live. Andrea contemplates the ways we cope with loneliness and the deeply rooted societal fears of disconnection and of death. Facing fear, confusion, and loss head on, Andrea reminds us that healing is a return to the self, a return to community. Andrea’s openness about their diagnosis and emotional journey, brings depth and emotion to the conversation. Through poem and spirituality, Andrea draws us to see the beauty in being alive in this particular life, in our particular bodies, at this particular time. Their presence and attention is life-giving. As Andrea shares their journey connecting to the eternal, genderless “We,” they invite listeners to contemplate their identities beyond this life alone. As we let the need to know fall away, what miracles might reveal themselves to us? Andrea Gibson is one of the most celebrated and influential spoken word poets of our time. Best known for their live performances, Gibson has changed the landscape of what it means to attend a “poetry show” altogether. To hear Gibson is like hearing songwriters play their music, their trademark honesty and vulnerability are on full display. Gibson’s poems center around LGBTQ issues, gender, feminism, mental health and the dismantling of oppressive social systems. The winner of the first Women’s World Poetry Slam, Gibson has gone on to be awarded the LGBTQ Out100 and has been featured on BBC, NPR and CSpan. Gibson is the author of seven award winning books and seven full length albums. Their live shows have become loving and supportive ecosystems for audiences to feel seen, heard, and held through Gibson’s art. Music by John Carrol Kirby (generously provided by Patience Records), Kesia Negata, and Katie Gray. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


KATRINA SPADE on New Life from Death /346

Death is a process of decomposition, how can we come to embrace this reality? This week, guest Katrina Spade joins Ayana for a fascinating conversation on the possibilities of burial practices, ways to connect with death, and the value in thoughtful death plans. Sharing her journey to founding Recompose, “a licensed, full-service, green funeral home in Seattle offering human composting,” Katrina shares that the way we design death rituals matters in how connected we feel to the process of death. Detailing the science, logistics, and art behind human composting, Katrina imbues the conversation with passion, concern, and a spirit of learning. Through Recompose, Katrina has witnessed the beauty that comes from watching new life blossom from death, and from the connections family members of the deceased can have with the soil created from the composting process. The intention and compassion we put into death-care matters. As Katrina reminds us, there is so much to be gained from intimacy with death. Katrina Spade is the founder and CEO of Recompose, a public benefit corporation leading the transformation of the funeral industry. Katrina is a designer and the inventor of a system that transforms the dead into soil (aka human composting). Since founding in 2017, Katrina and Recompose have led the successful legalization of human composting in Washington State in 2019. Recompose became the first company in the world to offer the service in December of 2020. The process is now also legal in Oregon, Colorado, Vermont, California., and New York. Katrina and her team have been featured in Fast Company, NPR, the Atlantic, BBC, Harper’s Magazine, and the New York Times. She is an Echoing Green Fellow, an Ashoka fellow, and a Harvard Kennedy School Visiting Social Innovator. Music by Yesol. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


KURT RUSSO on the People Under the Sea [ENCORE] / 345

It is with a heavy heart that we share that Tokitae, a Southern Resident Orca held unjustly in captivity for 53 years, has passed away. To honor her memory, this week we are rebroadcasting our episode with Kurt Russo on the People Under the Sea, originally aired in October of 2018. This conversation explores the powerful memory held by Southern Resident orcas, the threats they face from vessel noise, chemical pollutants, and declining Chinook salmon population, the health of the Salish Sea, and the efforts of the Lummi Nation to return Sk’aliCh’elh-tenaut (also known as Tokitae/Lolita), from where she was being held captive at Miami Seaquarium, to her natal waters in the Salish Sea. Tokitae’s life ended while in captivity, but we hope that her memory may serve to inspire the fight for right-relationship and reciprocity with our more-than-human-kin. Kurt Russo is the executive director of Se’Si’Le, an Indigenous-led nonprofit dedicated to the perpetuation and practical application of Indigenous ancestral knowledge. Kurt has worked with Indigenous communities since 1978 in the areas of sacred site protection, Indigenous treaty rights, environmental cross-cultural conflict resolution, and the intertextualization of ways of knowing nature. He was co-Founder and Executive Director of the Florence R. Kluckhohn Center for the Study of Values and the Native American Land Conservancy, helped establish the International Indigenous Exchange Program (Northwest Indian College), the Sacred Lands Conservancy, and the Foundation for Indigenous Medicine. He has a BS in Forestry from the University of Montana, an MS in Forestry from the University of Washington, and a Ph.D. in History from the University of California (Riverside). He is a veteran and served in Vietnam where he worked with Montagnard Indigenous communities. Music by Monplaisir and Amoeba. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


KEIARA WADE on Generations of Black Cowboys /344

Introducing listeners to her fierce devotion to community and care for the animal world, Keiara Wade, the Compton Cowgirl, considers the ways care work includes the human and more-than-human. Though the connection between humans and animals is often unspoken, it is a vital tie, and Keiara emphasizes the way the specific tie between human and horse can be incredibly therapeutic, healing, and nourishing. Keiara shares her journey with the Compton Cowboys and her experiences as a Black cowgirl. The Compton Cowboys were founded in 2017 by a group of Compton locals who had grown up riding together. Recognizing the importance of intergenerational community and influence, Keiara hopes that this program and connection to the horses can continue for generations to come. Compton Cowboys is about so much more than just riding, and Keiara shares the significance of making spaces for young people to feel heard and valued . The respect and accountability necessary for a good relationship with a horse is also necessary for a good relationship with each other. How might animals be our guides and companions in making the world more equitable? Keiara Wade is The Compton Cowgirl of the Compton Cowboys. She is in the process of pursuing her barrel racing career and becoming the first black woman to make it to the NFR. Horses have always been her positive outlet to the traumatic world in which she grew up. She believes in giving back to our younger generations by allowing them the experience of the equine world and possibly leading them away from the streets and gang violence. She recently moved to Houston to accomplish her dream, supported by the Compton Cowboys and the Compton Junior Equestrians program. She is a mother of two children Taylor and Michael. This episode of For The Wild is brought to you by Catori Life. Music by Jess Williamson, Kaivalya, and Sarah Maricha White. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


JAMES BRIDLE on Modes of Intelligence /343

What is intelligence beyond, preceding, and following human intelligence? This week, Ayana is joined by guest James Bridle in a conversation that considers multiple forms of intelligence and ways of being. Bringing a rich background of research on forms of intelligence, from artificial to mycelial, James posits that it is a critical failure to use human intelligence as the benchmark for all forms of knowing. Seeing intelligence as both relational and embodied, James points out that knowing has never been an independent or alienated act. Rather, it is our specific set of modern conditions which primes us for alienation and separation – both from ourselves and from the earth. James encourages listeners to move from helplessness and fear to agency. In the same way that human agency created these systems and methodologies, we can also harness our agency to change the way they are used, to rethink our relationships to technology itself. How we heal our relationships is how we heal the world. James Bridle is a writer, artist and technologist. Their artworks have been commissioned by galleries and institutions and exhibited worldwide and on the internet. Their writing on literature, culture and networks has appeared in magazines and newspapers including Wired, the Atlantic, the New Statesman, the Guardian, and the Financial Times. They are the author of 'New Dark Age' (2018) and 'Ways of Being' (2022), and they wrote and presented "New Ways of Seeing" for BBC Radio 4 in 2019. Their work can be found at Music by Memotone. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


TOKO-PA TURNER on Dreams of Belonging /342

This week’s guest, Toko-pa Turner, invites us to consider that our dreams may serve as important guides throughout our lives. Diving into the intimately intertwined world of psyche and matter, Toko-pa considers the ways we may rehabilitate our imaginative capacities. We cannot simply dispose of that which goes beyond physical observation. Instead, centering the importance of feelings and sensing, Toko-pa encourages us to take time and pay attention to dreams. Dreams and our interior worlds, according to Toko-pa, are deeply important within our personal searches for belonging. Modern society demands that we estrange parts of ourselves in order to “belong,” but this false belonging will never satisfy. Rather, Toko-pa focuses on finding interior belonging. What is internally guiding us towards our potential? Blending the mystical teachings of Sufism in which she was raised with a Jungian approach to dreams, Toko-pa Turner is a Canadian author, teacher, and dreamworker. She founded The Dream School in 2001, from which thousands of students have since graduated. She is the author of the award-winning book, Belonging: Remembering Ourselves Home, which explores the themes of exile and belonging through the lens of dreams, mythology, and memoirs. This book has resonated for readers worldwide, and has been translated into 10 different languages as well as winning multiple awards for excellence in publishing. Her work focuses on the relationship between psyche and nature, and how to follow our inner wisdom to meet with the social, psychological, and ecological challenges of our time. Music by Magnetic Vines and Tarotplane. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show


AMY GLENN on a Life in Thresholds /341

In this week’s episode, guest Amy Glenn invites listeners on a journey to consider the value in caregiving and companioning. Rooting the conversation in her experience as both a birth and death doula, Amy details the deep work of holding space for all of life’s moments. Amy points out the thresholds of everyday life, and the value in sitting with uncertainty. Companioning, storytelling, and ritual making are all vital as we come to contemplate what it means to hold space for death. Offering breathing techniques and a meditation on the breath that holds us between birth and death, Amy calls to mind the importance of making space for contemplation. How can we make space for self-care and self-regulation as we cope with the journeys of life and death? Amy Wright Glenn earned her MA in Religion and Education from Teachers College, Columbia University. She earned her BA from Reed College in the study of Religion. Amy taught for eleven years in the Religion and Philosophy Department at The Lawrenceville School in New Jersey earning the Dunbar Abston Jr. Chair for Teaching Excellence. She is a birth and death doula, hospital chaplain, Kripalu Yoga teacher, and founder of the Institute for the Study of Birth, Breath, and Death. From 2015 to 2020, Amy served as an active contributor to PhillyVoice writing on topics relating to birth, death, parenting, and spirituality. Amy is the author of Birth, Breath, and Death: Meditations on Motherhood, Chaplaincy, and Life as a Doula and Holding Space: On Loving, Dying, and Letting Go. Amy has trained thousands of professionals in the work of holding space for life’s transitions ~ and focuses specifically on grief and bereavement care. To learn more, visit: Music by Charlie Warren, Doe Paoro, and Amber Rubarth. Visit our website at for the full episode description, references, and action points. Support the show